Morgan Bellhave you read what the Terms and Conditions say about racism?
June 14th 2008 08:50
You will not post offensive material in your blogs. This may include but is not limited to racist or pornographic material. We retain the right to alter or delete material on any Orble blog without notice if it is deemed offensive or for any other reason.
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im having a slow-paced afternoon so i decided to have a browse around the Terms and Conditions . . . i obviously agreed to them at some point but i dont think i ever properly read over them . . . i actually thought there must be no moderator on Orble other than the blog writers/owners due to how frequently i see blatantly racist and sexist materials being posted willy nilly . . . perhaps the loophole is that if you dont say the really nasty stuff in the original post then Orble has no jurisdiction over resulting comments?
this is just my own musings over the culture of blogging, i certainly dont suggest censorship, we all have the right to reply with our disapproval or simply not read . . . however i do find it interesting that a code of conduct does exist . . . it is largely up to interpretation of course . . . but allow me to try and define "RACISM" as i see it and you can decide if youve noticed any floating around . . .
RACE
The term race or racial group usually refers to the concept of dividing humans into populations or groups on the basis of various sets of characteristics. The most widely used human racial categories are based on visible traits (especially skin color, cranial or facial features and hair texture), and self-identification.
ETHNICITY
An ethnic group is a group of human beings whose members identify with each other, usually on the basis of a presumed common genealogy or ancestry. Ethnic identity is decided partly by race but is also marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness and by common cultural, linguistic, religious, behavioral or biological traits.
Ethnicity and race are related concepts in that both are usually defined in terms of shared genealogy. Often, ethnicity also connotes shared cultural, linguistic, behavioural or religious traits. For example, to call oneself Jewish or Arab one immediately invokes a clutch of linguistic, religious, cultural and racial features that are held to be common within each ethnic category.
According to the United Nations conventions, there is no distinction between the term racial discrimination and ethnic discrimination.
XENOPHOBIA
Prejudice based on ethnicity of nationality rather than just race. Xenophobia is a fear or contempt of that which is foreign or unknown, especially of strangers or foreign people. Dislike against the genetically dissimilar out-group and nepotistic favoritism towards the genetically similar in-group. A xenophobic person is aware of their fear, and therefore genuinely believes at some level that the target is in fact a foreigner. A xenophobic person does not consider a minority population group to be part of the wider society. All cultures are subject to external influences, but when there is a political push to rid a nation of cultural elements which are considered alien it is considered xenophobic. Cultural xenophobia can be directed at foreign words being incorporated in a national language (ie: linguistic purification). Victims of xenophobia are often recent immigrants, but xenophobia may also be directed against a group which has been present for centuries. This form of xenophobia can elicit or facilitate hostile and violent reactions, such as mass expulsion of immigrants, or in the worst case, genocide.
ETHNIC NEPOTISM
Nepotism is the showing of favoritism toward relatives and friends, based upon that relationship, rather than on an objective evaluation of the persons merits, ability, or suitability.
Ethnic nepotism describes a human tendency for in-group bias or in-group favouritism applied on the ethnic level. In-group bias is the preferential treatment people give to whom they perceive to be members of their own groups.
RACISM
1. A belief or ideology that all members of each racial group possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially to distinguish it as being either superior or inferior to another racial group or racial groups.
2. A belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular racial group, and that it is also the prejudice based on such a belief.
3. The belief that human races have distinctive characteristics which determine their respective cultures, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule or dominate others.
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Comment by Kleonaptra
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i was surprised to learn we had terms and conditions, i guess we all tick a box when we join?
im sure theres a few nerds who will find it as interesting as i did!
Comment by S.L.
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Comment by Morgan Bell
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that was actually really funny!
i did a bit of a snortle imagining that particular group of people being chastised by the Orble admin . . . it tickled my funny bone!
and beyond the funny image of Obama and Spike Lee blogging, you do raise an excellent point, racism and the fear of minorities and foreigners occurs all over the world, in a variety of nations and cultures and skin colours . . . unfortunately it seems to be one of those few universal traits . . . but all we can hope for is it to keep getting better, if everyone makes an effort to understand each other etc
Comment by RubySoho
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Yesseeree, them black folks have it so easy...the nerve of them to pick on the white guy who ain't never done nuthin' wrong to them.
Comment by Morgan Bell
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you make an excellent point also!
minorities who are subjected to racism (constant escalating violent and torturous racism . . . resulting in death and degradation etc) may generalise about the "majority" racial group in their society as a defence mechanism . . . it becomes a vicious cycle
i dont know of anything particularly racist that has been said by the examples S.L. gave but basically to qualify as racism it would have to be saying another person is inferior because they exhibit the appearance, culture or religion etc of a larger ethnic group
Comment by S.L.
The Political Brief
Morgan, racism isn't only the notion that one group is inferior to another. Racism is also the act of stating publicly that you hate, dislike or distrust another group. Both Michelle and Barack Obama have clearly written and said that they don't like or trust white people. Rev. Wright made his hatred of whites abundantly clear from the pulpit. Sharpton and Jackson are repeatedly on the record as hating people because of the color of their skin. That is racism, plain and simple.
As for the silly idea that people today should have to continually pay reparations (in one form or another) for the sins of several generations past, give me a break! I had many ancestors who were slaves and none who ever owned any slaves.
Liberalism is the absolute worst thing that can happen to people of color. Years of empty promises and outright betrayals should have proven that beyond any doubt. Affirmative Action is a travesty that keeps the races seperated and promotes failure in those it purports to "help." Welfare has all but destroyed the black family. "Churches" like that of Rev. Wright incite racism and foment hatred. Dr. Martin Luther King wanted people to be judged by the "content of their character, not the color of their skin" and the way things are going, that'll never be allowed to happen.
Comment by RubySoho
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Yes, just like Hillary Clinton said "all women need to have at least one abortion in order to feel liberated" right?
For pity's sake woman, when are you going to stop making stuff up?
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Comment by RubySoho
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That racist enough for you Morgan?
I think we need to go black to discussing Nicola Roxon's limp hair...oh speaking of Roxon, maybe she'll let us borrow her noose for a good ol fanshioned southern hanging?
comment modified to add this: in case there are any other literal-minded people reading, I am clearly being sarcastic here.
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(Joking again....haha)
Comment by Morgan Bell
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Michelle Obama went to Princeton in the 80s and wrote a paper comparing the involvement of blacks at Princeton in the 70s with the time she attended, from what ive read of that paper she expressed no hatred of other races, she was just saying that being on a white dominated campus emphasised how "black" she felt . . . she was expressing her experiences of being a minority
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ive havent seen Rev Wright say he hated another race, only the quip i heard that was blown out of proportion was him saying the "united states of white america" which isnt really saying anything derogatory or hateful about all white people
if you have some quotes or references or links etc i would be interested to read them
reparations is a whole another kettle of fish but basically to avoid future incidents of slavery and genocide people need to not falsely assign negative traits to any group of people . . . if black people in your country are dehumanising whites with incorrect generalisations that impact upon their rights then that is equally wrong, two wrongs never make a right
Comment by RubySoho
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yeah weird how the terms are conditions are there but noone really seems to know they exist . . . i just randomly stumbled onto them when i was in "My Orble" and i saw a button called "Checklist" and one of the dot points directed me there . . . all very interesting
Comment by S.L.
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............................. ............................. ............................. .
In Obama's own words (Scary)
Subject: In Obama's own words (Very, very Scary)
This guy wants to be our President and control our government. Pay close attention to the last comment!! Below are a few lines from Obama's books. These are passages in his own words:
From Dreams of My Father: 'I ceased to advertise my mother's race at the age of 12 or 13, when I began to suspect that by doing so I was ingratiating myself to whites.'
From Dreams of My Father: 'I found a solace in nursing a pervasive sense of grievance and animosity against my mother’s race.'
From Dreams of My Father: 'There was something about him that made me wary, a little too sure of himself, maybe. And white.'
From Dreams of My Father: 'It remained necessary to prove which side you were on, to show your loyalty to the black masses, to strike out and name names.'
From Dreams of My Father: 'I never emulate white men and brown men whose fates didn't speak to my own. It was into my father's image, the black man, son of Africa, that I had packed all the attributes I sought in myself, the attributes of Martin and Malcolm, DuBois and Mandela.'
And here's the clincher: (grab on to something when you read this
From Audacity of Hope: 'I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.'
_____________________________ ________
Comment by S.L.
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OBAMA'S MILITANT RACISM REVEALED
In her senior thesis at Princeton, Michele Obama, the wife of Barack Obama stated that America was a nation founded on crime and hatred. Moreover, she stated that whites in America were ineradicably racist. The 1985 thesis, titled "Princeton-Educated Blacks and the Black Community" was written under her maiden name, Michelle LaVaughn Robinson.
Michelle Obama stated in her thesis that to "Whites at Princeton , it often seems as if, to them, she will always be Black first..." However, it was reported by a fellow black classmate, If those "Whites at Princeton " really saw Michelle as one who always would "be Black first," it seems that she gave them that impression.
Most alarming is Michele Obama's use of the terms separationist and integrationist when describing the views of black people.
Mrs. Obama clearly identifies herself with a separationistï view of race.
By actually working with the Black lower class or within their communities as a result of their ideologies, a separationist may better understand the desperation of their situation and feel more hopeless about a resolution as opposed to an integrationist who is ignorant to their plight.
Obama writes that the path she chose by attending Princeton would likely lead to her "further integration and/or assimilation into a white cultural and social structure that will only allow me to remain on the periphery of society; never becoming a full participant."
Michele Obama clearly has a chip on her shoulder.
Not only does she see separate black and white societies in America , but she elevates black over white in her world.
Here is another passage that is uncomfortable and ominous in meaning:
There was no doubt in my mind that as a member of the black community, I am obligated to this community and will utilize all of my present and future resources to benefit the black community first and foremost.
What is Michelle Obama planning to do with her future resources if she's first lady that will elevate black over white in America ?
The following passage appears to be a call to arms for affirmative action policies that could be the hallmark of an Obama administration.
Predominately white universities like Princeton are socially and academically designed to cater to the needs of the white students comprising the bulk of their enrollments.
The conclusion of her thesis is alarming.
Michelle Obama's poll of black alumni concludes that other black students at Princeton do not share her obsession with blackness. But rather than celebrate, she is horrified that black alumni identify with our common American culture more than they value the color of their skin. I hoped that these findings would help me conclude that despite the high degree of identification with whites as a result of the educational and occupational path that black Princeton alumni follow, the alumni would still maintain a certain level of identification with the black community. However, these findings do not support this possibility.
Is it no wonder that most black alumni ignored her racist questionnaire? Only 89 students responded out of 400 who were asked for input.
Michelle Obama does not look into a crowd of Obama supporters and see Americans. She sees black people and white people eternally conflicted with one another.
The thesis provides a trove of Mrs. Obama's thoughts and world view seen through a race-based prism.
This is a very divisive view for a potential first lady that would do untold damage to race relations in this country in a Barack Obama administration.
Michelle Obamai's intellectually refined racism should give all Americans pause for deep concern.
Now maybe she's changed, but she sure sounds like someone with an axe to grind with America . Will the press let Michelle get a free pass over her obviously racist comment about American whites? I am sure that it will. But it shouldn't.
FYI:
I am not a supporter of any of the candidates for president. In fact, they all leave a bad taste in my mouth. However, I am definitely sick of the main stream media (MSM) feeding us all this crap about Obama being an agent of change.
Has anyone stopped to think what kind of change; really?
PS: We paid for her scholarship.
Comment by Morgan Bell
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thanks for the Obama quotes
i have seen that email debunked a couple of times
heres a link to Fact Check CLICKHERE
and heres a link to Snopes CLICKHERE
Misleading e-mail: From Audacity of Hope: "I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."
Actual quote from "The Audacity of Hope" [pg. 261]: Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific assurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.
Comment by RubySoho
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Comment by Morgan Bell
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with regards to Michelle Obama the link i provided above was to a highly critical conservative commentary on her thesis highlighting the quotes they thought were dubious and i am yet to see a quote that i think is "militant racism", she is identifying herself as black and discussing the difficulties of being black, she is not expressing hatred to all whites or even generalising about all whites, she is speaking about particular white people she knew on campus and doing so in a respectful way, she is speaking about her feelings
Comment by S.L.
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Michelle Obama says she was NEVER proud of her country until her husband ran for president. That was in front of a camera as well. Odd how she felt no pride in the country that paid for her education, gave her all the rights and freedoms she enjoys, made her a millionare and may even be foolish enough to elect her husband to the highest office in the land.
Comment by Morgan Bell
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is there something wrong with the "Nation of Islam" church?
i think you are starting to talk about patriotism not racism, in which case i dont really see the correlation
my intention was to define racism and show how it includes religious and cultural elements . . . automatically disliking an individual from a minority (immigrant or otherwise) because they display similar attributes to the larger foreign ethnic group is racism
believing your race/culture is superior to another is racism
i am not denying it is equally possible for a black person to be racist, im sure it happens all over the world, but nothing i have seen convincing me that Barack and Michelle Obama are racist
Comment by S.L.
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no i didnt know anything about the "Nation of Islam" church, thanks for pointing me in the right direction, i have been sure to look them up
they seem to have some unusual views about creation
so basically Barack Obama is a member of Chicago's Trinity United Church of Christ. Its minister, and Obama's spiritual adviser, is the Rev Wright . . . Rev Wrights daughter runs Trumpet Newsmagazine which honoured Louis Farrakhan, who is the leader of the "Nation of Islam" church, for his work with the black community . . . Farrakhan expressed his support of Obama and Obama clearly denounced Farrakhans racists comments calling them unacceptable and reprehensible
Obama also said about Farrakhan:
CLICKHERE for full article
it seems fairly clear that Obama is opposed to racism
Comment by Lester Caudill
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Racism exsist in all races, just to say whites are the only ones that can be racist is just plain stupid, and racist.
Isn't it time that the black people get over the slave mentality it's stopping them from going forward, don't they know that it is keeping them as slaves still.
Many races in the past have been slaves, but they have moved on to bigger and better things.
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Comment by Jim Stillman
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Morgan, Ruby and others, you are wasting your time and energy attempting to dispute SL's ravings; she will just call you more names and invent more quotes.
Lester, as you know, I am not a Christian and hesitate to cite doctrines of your faith. But isn't bearing false witness and spewing hateful stories frowned upon?
SL will respond, as in the past, suggesting that my deceased parents are fortunate not to read my posts. But, Lester, you are better than that.
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So not going to debate this, no point, will only get frustrated as usual, just wanted to say, good on you, and I really like the picture.
Michaelie
Comment by Lester Caudill
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We know the past holds the problems, not the solutions. To dwell on something no one alive today had anything to do with is not going to get us anywhere.
I am not responsible for the sins of my fathers. I do regret how the black people were treated, and feel it was a great injustice to them. As I do others that have had to face racism.
And Jim there are racism in every race, and to deny that is just being foolish. But what I meant by the blacks keeping themselves as slaves is that the leaders such as Jesse Jackson, Al sharpton, the democratic party, and others have lied to them and kept them hanging on to the past instead of looking to the future.
Senator Barack Obama should be commended for his accomplishment, and lets face it he did not get here with just black voters did he.
But Jim I feel prejudice is almost as bad as racism, and that's something that is more rampant in our society. It is even here at Orble among its writers, and Jim it is not one sided either I know S.L. and myself are frowned upon by all you otherwise perfect people, because we do not hold your alls political opinions.
Comment by Morgan Bell
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who said only whites could be racist?
nowhere in my post or following comments have i said that only whites could be racist, to the contrary i have stated many times that it is a trait not owned by just one race and people of any colour have the potential to be racist
if you have come over here determined to be irrational and irrevelant then please dont bother
i was actually having a civilised conversation with S.L about what racism is, she was citing some examples and i was reading them and researching them further to give opinion
to say all black people have a "slave mentality" was an excellent example of racism
hi S.L.
im sure most people have some degree of racist thoughts, a bias to the group of people we consider to be like us (see Ethnic Nepotism in the original post), i think politicians, writers and public speakers etc have a duty to rise above nepotism and fear of the unknown and act and speak objectively in the public forum.
you may be right about Obama, he may have had a few racist thoughts in his head at any one time, it is natural of any human being when faced with the foreign, but i admire Obama and other politicians (republican aswell) who endeavour to lead by good example and show that discrimination is not acceptable
it would be very hard for a person to live their entire lives and not associate with anyone who had ever said a racist thing
i dont judge people for saying racist things in the past i only hope they will strive to improve themselves in the future
Comment by Morgan Bell
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i can not guarentee it but i hope S.L. is doing me the courtesy of reading and considering what i am saying and following my links, as that is the courtesy i am extending her . . . i have learnt about the "Nation of Islam" church today and am starting to understand a few pieces of mis-information that have been spread to paint the Obamas as racists, for what purpose i dont know?
does (theoretically) stating that Obama is racist justify the racism of anyone (everyone) else?
is simply speaking in terms of race to explain your experience as an outsider racism?
personally i say no on both counts
hi Tracy,
haha thankyou, i feel brave!
well i think its a topic that needs to be adressed amongst bloggers . . . what is racism? and did you realise racism is considered unacceptable by the orble community?
hi Michaelie,
i would love to hear your opinions on racism regardless of the conversations im having with others!
personally i dont think labelling yourself or those around you as white or black or jewish or arab etc is racist (perhaps racialism) but the problem begins when we start a sentence "ALL white people . . . " do or think this and that
or "ALL christian people . . . " do or think this and that
and that becomes far more dangerous (although no less wrong) when the group in question are a minority or immigrants as it can lead to dehumanisation, negative stereotypes, and ultimately unwarranted hostility and violence
i am open to hear how anyone would define "RACISM", it is an interesting topic, and i thank you all for your comments
Comment by Morgan Bell
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regarding the picture
you can actually buy the artwork featured as this posts display pic for the bargain price of $2500 . . . the artist is a Pittsburgh painter and sculptor
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not that i really expect you to buy it haha
but thats some trivia for you . . . and theres some other works at the same link
Comment by Michaelie
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Had a look at the other art, was amused by 'Butt Spot', haha, but the Andy Warhol one still grabs me. Wish I had a spare few grand, I really would buy it.
Comment by Morgan Bell
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thankyou, "fair" is a fantastic compliment
theres a few issues i find a bit pointless to argue on Orble too, some politically charged topics just go around in circles because both sides are so set in their ways . . . i would expect that in this day and age it is generally accepted that racism isnt constructive
Rich Bach is a fabulous artist, i wonder if he has posters of his work? maybe something i will have to look into!
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This post was about terms and conditions right?
ALL races and creeds have racists amongst them. In fact as much as we may loathe it (and I do), if we are perfectly honest with ourselves, all of us are at least a little racist at times. Anyone that disagrees with that statement needs to take a good hard look at themselves. We have all had a racist thought or said something mildly racist at one time or another, it's a sad fact of being human. Not something to be proud of but it's true.
As you said, bigotry comes in many different forms not just race. I think that has been proved above. There are some very obvious examples of bigotry showing in some of the statements above.
big·ot·ry
–noun, plural -ries.
1. stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.
Morgan, this was an extremely interesting post about racism and how we define it which has been hijacked into a political argument on the US election. As usual I find your post and your comments well thought out and written. I'm not going to be drawn into an argument with any of your readers. I just found it interesting that a post about one form of bigotry sparked an argument filled with another.
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lovely to see you!
thanks for the added info on "BIGOTRY", im always interested in definitions . . . i think often terms are thrown around willy nilly and we dont really know what they mean or fully understand the concepts behind them
i genuinely try to listen to everyones opinions and find all new information interesting
i was basically looking for alternate definitions of racism and opinions on how much bloggers feel it is their duty to avoid being racist etc
i grew up in an all white environment and it has taken me the better part of ten years of city living to understand other races and ethnicities and cultures etc, i am certainly not perfect
all we can do is educate ourselves and try our best
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i guess that would come under the broad banner of "offensive", but yeah perhaps other forms of discrimination like sexism and homophobia deserve specific mention?
maybe the suggestion could be raised on PADSOC or the writers forum?
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Of course, I now have about 4 posts to be written for PADSOC!!! I'm way behind on my Orbling.
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i posted a couple of things to PADSOC while you were away to keep up the readership and stop it from going inactive etc . . . its a fantastic idea for a blog so i hope everyone keeps it going and keeps thinking about how we can all play a part in eliminating discrimination . . . i look forward to seeing any new posts you write!
keep up the good work!
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